Curse

Numa Pompilius · Jan 08, 2008, 12:27 AM // 00:27

I avoid the Realm of Torment because it's dark an dull, not because it's too hard, but I'll agree on this: The environmental effects are cheesy and annoying.

I hate environmental effects. I hated them in Glints Lair when they were far weaker, and I hate them in RoT when they're extremely annoying. They serve no purpose but to slow the game down - and how does slowing the game down add to the fun?

Arkantos · Jan 08, 2008, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

I hate environmental effects. I hated them in Glints Lair when they were far weaker, and I hate them in RoT when they're extremely annoying. They serve no purpose but to slow the game down - and how does slowing the game down add to the fun?

It doesn't add to the fun, it adds to the challenge. This area is the last area of Nightfall, it's obviously going to be somewhat challenging. As you get further in a game, it becomes more challenging. Every game is like that. This game wouldn't be fun if every area was a walk in the park.

mrmango · Jan 08, 2008, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Numa, it's to provide a challenge and filter out the bad players, but obviously it's only half good at that.

RoT should be that hard for people who think mending is a good skill.
You know, all your whining has made me want to bring my mesmer and do all of those quests, I think I'll do it them this weekend.

MithranArkanere · Jan 08, 2008, 12:46 AM // 00:46

I made the quests long time ago. They were fun, interesting and not hard at all. I made them with Lightbringer rank 3.

The harder was the one to save Keeper Jinyssa. I forgot abou it after 3 tries, then came back last weekend after 4 months. I made it with Henchmen and Heroes, thanks to a better HeroHench team build. And it was surprisingly easier. This time I had LB 8, though.

The only thing I can say it's that it felt like Margonites and Torment creatures having less health than the last time.

Numa Pompilius · Jan 08, 2008, 01:20 AM // 01:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

It doesn't add to the fun, it adds to the challenge. --- This game wouldn't be fun if every area was a walk in the park.

I like challenge, as in "harder". I don't like challenge as in "slow and tedious".
And "slow and tedious" is what the environmental effects achieve. Give me bigger groups of mobs, mixed groups, smarter skillsets, better positioning - but wtf cheese-out is upping difficulty by health, energy, or skill slowdown/degen?

Like I said: that's not challenging-hard. It's challenging-dull.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrmango

Numa, it's to provide a challenge and filter out the bad players, but obviously it's only half good at that. ---
You know, all your whining has made me want to bring my mesmer and do all of those quests, I think I'll do it them this weekend.

Be my guest. My mesmer already have.

Div · Jan 08, 2008, 01:33 AM // 01:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by MirkoTeran

You're bad at game. So whats new?

What this guy said.

Kanyatta · Jan 08, 2008, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

[*]Shadow Monk - Light of deliverance heals it and all other shadow creatures, and it's too fast to interrupt

Your thread was almost credible until you said this. If you cannot interrupt a 2 second cast time spell, /uninstall, for the sake of everyone here.

Also, the whole "Call To T3h Torment iz t3h IMBA", they take 2x damage, its like them frenzy-ing for you without the IAS, I consider it a help more than a hurt.

HawkofStorms · Jan 08, 2008, 05:10 AM // 05:10

/notsigned

I can play HM RoT regularly with H/H.

Off topic: Stop insulting TenderWolf guys. Or else I'll have to start christening people as the new Zinger.

Darkobra · Jan 08, 2008, 06:26 AM // 06:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

Domain of Pain/Gate of Pain - 20 damage every time you use a skill (eventually it adds up)
Domain of Secrets - Skills cost 40% more energy to cast
Domain of Fear - Move, attack, and activate skills 15% slower
Nightfallen Jahai - Skills are disabled for an additional 3 seconds

And there are probably more but I forgot them. And let's not forget this:

Big mobs of level 28 Torment creatures:

Shadow Monk - Light of deliverance heals it and all other shadow creatures, and it's too fast to interrupt
Shadow Elemental - Fire Storm and Mind Blast will wipe the party quickly
Rain of Terror - same thing
Arm of Insanity - Barrage and Quickening Zephyr spirit, making skills cost even more energy while in Domain of Secrets
All Torment creatures - Call to the Torment

Domain of Pain: Heal Party, Light of Deliverance.
Domain of Secrets: Better energy management, not spamming attacks without necessity.
Domain of Fear: Here's a new one that I didn't have back then - Essence of Celerity.
Nightfallen Jahai: Wait three seconds, don't run a Searing Flames build.

Shadow Monk: Broadhead Arrow, Backfire, Diversion...
Shadow Elemental: Same, but MOVE OUT the AoE...
Rain of Terror: Same thing.
Arm of Insanity: Need I bother with this one?
Torment Creatures: Spike the ones who use it quickly. All on the same target.

I completed Nightfall the first day it came out. If you played the past two games, none of it is new. All you have to do is read the skills and think the best way to counter them.

If you fail, think why you failed, adapt and move on.

Uber Mass · Jan 08, 2008, 06:47 AM // 06:47

Maybe you need someone to show you how its done cause its not that hard imho

I D E L E T E D I · Jan 08, 2008, 07:01 AM // 07:01

So let me get this straight. You are saying you cant interupt a flipping TWO SECOND LoD??????
ill agree with alot of the people here, stop being bad at the game then make some good suggestions. All your suggestions so far have been 2 lines of
"XXX HAS TO BE CHANGED". And so far all the onces i have read were very terribaed suggestions.

/Notsigned(has to go)

Hyper Cutter · Jan 08, 2008, 07:15 AM // 07:15

Call to the Torment at least needs to be fixed so Torment Creatures don't use it early. I've seen them using it in the 50-75% health range, it's pretty annoying...

MisterB · Jan 08, 2008, 07:23 AM // 07:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyper Cutter

Call to the Torment at least needs to be fixed so Torment Creatures don't use it early. I've seen them using it in the 50-75% health range, it's pretty annoying...

That's not always a bad thing. In fact, I always laugh maniacally when they do that because it means I can proceed to slaughter them mercilessly. They take double damage after all. It's fun hitting them for 200+ Eviscerate, then Executioner's for the kill.

tmr819 · Jan 08, 2008, 07:48 PM // 19:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

Okay, I have a quest log filled with at least 10 quests that need to be done in the Realm of Torment.

Me, too. So, we're in the same boat. I had been procrastinating on these quests because of these very groups. But I'm finding it's not so bad, and none of my toons has Lightbringer 8. I hate farming for LB rep so I just started doing the quests and have managed to complete most of them just fine at LB lvl 3 -- even Master's Difficulty ones (like that one where you have to defend the Wardens -- it was difficult, yes, but not impossible). The highest Lightbringer rank I have on any of my toons even now is level 4. Level 8 must be very nice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

Domain of Pain/Gate of Pain - 20 damage every time you use a skill (eventually it adds up)
Domain of Secrets - Skills cost 40% more energy to cast
Domain of Fear - Move, attack, and activate skills 15% slower
Nightfallen Jahai - Skills are disabled for an additional 3 seconds

The debuffs are a nuisance, but you get used to them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

Big mobs of level 28 Torment creatures:

Shadow Monk - Light of deliverance heals it and all other shadow creatures, and it's too fast to interrupt
Shadow Elemental - Fire Storm and Mind Blast will wipe the party quickly
Rain of Terror - same thing
Arm of Insanity - Barrage and Quickening Zephyr spirit, making skills cost even more energy while in Domain of Secrets
All Torment creatures - Call to the Torment

Really, these groups are not all that bad. Just pull carefully and prioritize your target. I always go after the Rains of Terror first. If there is more than one, I lock a Broad Head Arrow interrupter Hero on one, while the rest of us take down the other. Then I go for Word of Madness and Arm(s) of Insanity. If you also have Ward against Melee, from you and/or a Hero, it buys you time. If some torment creature is getting whittled down in health, hit it with Lightbringer's Gaze at that point and chances are good Call to the Torment will never get activated; in other words, slam dunk them when they are at low health and start their "calling." In Shadow Groups, I usually BHA lockout the Monk and finish off the elementalists first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tender Wolf

This really needs to be changed. Get rid of either the environmental effects, Call to the Torment (it's hard enough without more monsters popping out becuase people can't kill them fast enough, or at least make it interruptable instead of isntantly activating), and/or fix the clumped mobs. Anything so it's not so dang hard. If a rank 8 LB can't even survive out there then it's too hard.

I don't agree about it needing to be changed. It's just a matter of learning the right tactics.

I feel your pain, really I do. But if I have learned one thing in this game it's that "impossible" areas are not impossible at all, it's just a matter of practice, strategy, and knowing what critters in a given mob need to be priority 1. Locking interrupting Heroes on the 2nd and 3rd priority monsters in a given group while you take down the 1st priority monster has also proven to be a successful tactic for me. It's one of the wonderful things about Heroes!

With practice, you will find it is really not so "dang hard" after all.

T-D-C · Jan 08, 2008, 09:29 PM // 21:29

Also you may want to abandon some quests and do them 1 at a time. Some quests add multiple enemies to a single area making it that much more difficult.

Try doing them one by one and see if that helps.

Squishy ftw · Jan 08, 2008, 09:57 PM // 21:57

/notsigned

The area is not too hard, it's something you're doing wrong.

I suggest you post your/your hero's builds because you really shouldn't be having any problems in this area as a r8 LB. I actually finished nightfall a week ago on my monk(r2 LB) whitout any real problems. And I'm pretty bad at monking, I can tell you that

Also take note of the good suggestions made here, like pulling, which is in certain areas in RoT extremely useful.

So, read all the suggestions and use them, alter your hero builds and try again. If you're still having problems, feel free to pm me in-game. I love tormented areas(40% more dmg ftw)

Tatile · Jan 08, 2008, 10:01 PM // 22:01

I'm surprised this isn't closed yet, just seems like flame-bait to me. Ah well, tis such that those who whine get publicly rediculed.

The Realm of Torment isn't that hard, unless you either:
A) Have no idea what you're doing;
B) Have no Lightbringer rank;
or
C) Cannot see where you're going wrong or fail to accept that you are going wrong.

In fact, A and C apply to all areas of the game...
/notsigned.

Pyro maniac · Jan 08, 2008, 10:10 PM // 22:10

I agree it needs a change, but not by making it easier

atm only cookie-cutter builds can run through this area. Would prefer to have the area more different kinds of foes and skills. So it actually becomes fun instead of just spamming Save Yourselves and let the ele's support you.
That's pretty much the reason I don't PvE that much, the foes are just strong because of the high level and the fact they can spam 3-4 exhaustion skills and then die. No challenge involved in defeating them.

Darkobra · Jan 08, 2008, 10:12 PM // 22:12

Only "cookie cutter builds" can get you through realm of torment? Uh...

NecroticChanter · Jan 08, 2008, 11:12 PM // 23:12

/unsigned

That area is supposed to be hard...
First, the shadow monk uses LoD...you do know about the recent nerf of that skill right? You're a ranger too, 2 second cast is too fast for u? The arms of insanity do have a crazy high dmg barrage. Answer=Aegis. Careful pulling will get you through. Call of Torment means that they will take double damage...just pressure that one creature until it dies. To begin with, don't attack them all at once, focus on their healers-->nukers--> tanks.

Lastly, Sab's 3 necro builds are the answer.